714 replies to this topic

[Juandalyn]

Well, it's not that unlikely, to be honest. I wouldn't be surprised if at least someone hit 26 before graduating. But I'm sure that the next 5 years will be filled with graduations. Yes, also older ones.

 

I always wonder why girls stay idols. Don't get me wrong, the income is decent, they get to perform and do idol stuff, but at some point they can't grow anymore. That's why it's called a "graduation", not just "end of contract". Honestly, at some point in life I think being an idol actually keeps you back more than allow you to grow. You can't love, your timetable is strict, it's very likely that some wota talk about every little thing you do. I honestly don't get why you'd want to be an idol over the age of 20, let alone 25. 

[megumibex]

Well some people don't want relationships, a lot of people like being provided with tasks so they have some direction in life and if it's something you've known since you were a child you may be scared to give it up (similar to the feeling of "Yay I graduated high school, I'm finally free!" and "Oh shit, I've graduated high school, wtf do I do now?").

[taylorniw]

Well, it's not that unlikely, to be honest. I wouldn't be surprised if at least someone hit 26 before graduating. But I'm sure that the next 5 years will be filled with graduations. Yes, also older ones.

 

I always wonder why girls stay idols. Don't get me wrong, the income is decent, they get to perform and do idol stuff, but at some point they can't grow anymore. That's why it's called a "graduation", not just "end of contract". Honestly, at some point in life I think being an idol actually keeps you back more than allow you to grow. You can't love, your timetable is strict, it's very likely that some wota talk about every little thing you do. I honestly don't get why you'd want to be an idol over the age of 20, let alone 25. 

 

If you're a successful idol, I can see why it would be difficult to leave being the big fish. The idea of transitioning to being just another entertainer is probably one lots of girls struggle with. Especially because I think the more famous you are, the harder it is to break away from being X from Y group. I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of girls in the indie groups are just doing it for fun.

 

Edit: I can actually also sort of imagine the reverse (if you decided not to go to college), where you've been an idol in a mid to low tier group for like 5, 6, 7 years and feel like it hasn't really set you up future success in the business.

[Ares13]

^
^
^ lol ..
I think its because they got nothing to do if they stop ..
or they got so use to it that they are more fearful of changing their lifestyle ..

Basically .. I think we got to consider on what is the final distinction for them ..
I think to many under the western culture would be to build a career and being self-reliant and not depending on a man for their livelihood ..
But I think for Japanese culture, their idea would be to start a family, and slowly moving towards not working but taking care of kids while the man provide for the family ..
So to get to this point .. they do not have to worry about it as former idols especially from a very well known organization would have many suitors ..

Furthermore, when they pass like 20 years old, they will be considered an adult .. that's when they think about what they are going to do ..
That is the period I fear most about idols because they will think too much and leave ..
But if we survive past that period, they tend to stop thinking about their future and just go on with life ..

So that's what I think ..

[Juandalyn]

^They could go on with m-line. Like, I don't expect any of the °C-ute girls to just jump off entertainment business in a heartbeat to have a family on their own. Same with Berryz, none of them has mentioned dating someone or something along the lines. 

 

Well some people don't want relationships, a lot of people like being provided with tasks so they have some direction in life and if it's something you've known since you were a child you may be scared to give it up (similar to the feeling of "Yay I graduated high school, I'm finally free!" and "Oh shit, I've graduated high school, wtf do I do now?").

 

I get the relationship part, but the other thing is simply a part of growing up. And honestly, I think at some point you just get tired. Maybe not at 20, but at 25 probably. 

 

If you're a successful idol, I can see why it would be difficult to leave being the big fish. The idea of transitioning to being just another entertainer is probably one lots of girls struggle with. Especially because I think the more famous you are, the harder it is to break away from being X from Y group. I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of girls in the indie groups are just doing it for fun.

 

Edit: I can actually also sort of imagine the reverse (if you decided not to go to college), where you've been an idol in a mid to low tier group for like 5, 6, 7 years and feel like it hasn't really set you up future success in the business.

 

I see how it could be difficult, but as mentioned before, I don't think it's good to stay in one spot for too long either. MM hasn't really moved onwards since 2014. Aside from wota nobody knows the girls' names. And while I get that they don't know what to do after graduation it's only getting worse if they keep on clinging onto it.

[Ares13]

^ .. well .. M-line vs MM ? I think there is a big difference ..
Basically, C-ute and Berryz are unique as I think they just could not keep it together .. I don't think all of them wanted to go off ..
furthermore, C-ute are too recent .. Look at Aichan and Gakisan
Anyway .. I am just saying for some of them and its impossible to cover all of them ..

[Juandalyn]

True, true. By the way I don't want them out or anything, I just don't think it's good to be stuck somewhere. That being said, I think the girls aged 17-18 are more likely to graduate, since they still have make a decision about their future.

[taylorniw]

^They could go on with m-line. Like, I don't expect any of the °C-ute girls to just jump off entertainment business in a heartbeat to have a family on their own. Same with Berryz, none of them has mentioned dating someone or something along the lines. 

 

Well some people don't want relationships, a lot of people like being provided with tasks so they have some direction in life and if it's something you've known since you were a child you may be scared to give it up (similar to the feeling of "Yay I graduated high school, I'm finally free!" and "Oh shit, I've graduated high school, wtf do I do now?").

 

I get the relationship part, but the other thing is simply a part of growing up. And honestly, I think at some point you just get tired. Maybe not at 20, but at 25 probably. 

 

If you're a successful idol, I can see why it would be difficult to leave being the big fish. The idea of transitioning to being just another entertainer is probably one lots of girls struggle with. Especially because I think the more famous you are, the harder it is to break away from being X from Y group. I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of girls in the indie groups are just doing it for fun.

 

Edit: I can actually also sort of imagine the reverse (if you decided not to go to college), where you've been an idol in a mid to low tier group for like 5, 6, 7 years and feel like it hasn't really set you up future success in the business.

 

I see how it could be difficult, but as mentioned before, I don't think it's good to stay in one spot for too long either. MM hasn't really moved onwards since 2014. Aside from wota nobody knows the girls' names. And while I get that they don't know what to do after graduation it's only getting worse if they keep on clinging onto it.

 

True, but change can be difficult. I think everyone knows someone who's gotten or is stuck job-wise. And I don't expect 18 and 19 year olds to be experts at career decisions.

[Sugaya Risako]

^^ It's not impossible. Yasuda, Abe, Kago, Tsuji, Iida, Ishikawa, Yaguchi all graduated/left between May 2003, and May 2005. That's seven members in 2 years. And their tenures were even shorter (except for maybe Iida and Yaguchi) than most of the current members in the danger zone. That's why I'm saying another grad wave is coming soon. Yes, there's a chance they stay until they are grandmothers, I'm just saying you shouldn't be surprised if they don't. Even if they don't want double/triple grads anymore, they still have two tours a year, so it's entirely possible.
 

we would have to have at least two graduations a year three times in the next 10 years for none of them to break that record

I think it's only twice in 10 years.

i agree, but i think harunan and eripon aren't going anywhere anytime soon. One of them might try to break nakazawa's record.

[Ares13]

True, true. By the way I don't want them out or anything, I just don't think it's good to be stuck somewhere. That being said, I think the girls aged 17-18 are more likely to graduate, since they still have make a decision about their future.

Well .. we got to look at the other side too ..
If they stick around too long with the about the same line up .. it will get cold and we may get the dark ages again ..
But of they leave too quickly .. they will also lose more fans than they can gain ..
Guess it is a tough balance ..

For me, even though I do plan for succession and I have never follow an idol as my no.1 for more than 4 years

I am into my 2.5year with Maria and she is 16 ..
I think if Maria leave when she is still my no.1, it would be the end for me for everything idol ..
So to some fans, we really really need them to stay as long as possible because it is the end if it is on the wrong timing

[Juandalyn]

While they're losing popular members (for example, Duu) I think they also have good choices with Maria, Yokoyan and Chisaki    not to mention that 12th gen, despite Western fandom taking a long time to warm up to them, aren't unpopular with the wota either (Akane aside). 

[SailorKame]

On the topic of why some of the girls stick around past 18-19 as idols, I think we also have to take into account that for some girls being idols (or at least idols within HP) is probably their 'dream' and they stay out of loyalty and love for HP and its history. It's a paycheck sure, but it's not like they are drowning in outside work, so the older members aren't really in it for the big opportunities now or after they graduate (thinking of Ayacho and Fukuchan here for example, both well known for loving MM/HP)

[ajma93632]

I wonder how many members does UFA pretend Angerme to have, of course as more members more sales but it'd be strange to see Angerme as a 13nin group too if that happens then just the music would be the difference between them and MM (not saying that it's bad). And I still wish for an stable MM line up, so I hope nobody plans to graduate at least the next year and that as time goes by the group and the girls gain more fans so when the next graduation comes UFA stop wanting the group to keep 13 members, maybe resuce to 11 if the menbers get more popular in the future.

[zam（仮）]

Looking at the idol scene in general, the graduation age is actually going up as more and more idols are actually still active in their early to mid 20's nowadays. This might encourage H!P girls to stay active longer than usual. I think Dawa has voiced her desire to stay on longer.

Just an example, Negicco celebrated their 14th anniversary yesterday. Nao is 29, Megu is 28 and Kaede is 25. They started in 2003.

[Ares13]

^ ya .. and it seem more and more idols are graduating around 18 and below ..
I think that have sort of make way for the older idols to stay longer ..
Furthermore, I think having idol stay longer works better now ..
As in the past, the thinking use to be people getting bored when an idols stay are too long ..
But with so many idols giving up too early, they rob their fans of the chance of seeing them grow all the way past adulthood ..
I think fans now would prefer to support an idol for like 10 years rather than just keep changing up every 3-4 years as the girls just graduate prematurely for whatever dumb reason ..

^
^ Actually the size of ANGERME is beginning to scare me ..
I am beginning to see a likelihood of a big senior clean out as they have been injecting too many high popularity type and similar characteristics new members into the group ..

[minaeshi]

I wonder how many members does UFA pretend Angerme to have, of course as more members more sales but it'd be strange to see Angerme as a 13nin group too if that happens then just the music would be the difference between them and MM (not saying that it's bad). And I still wish for an stable MM line up, so I hope nobody plans to graduate at least the next year and that as time goes by the group and the girls gain more fans so when the next graduation comes UFA stop wanting the group to keep 13 members, maybe resuce to 11 if the menbers get more popular in the future.

 

A stable line up is the last thing MM needs. The group is literally based off the graduations and additions of new members. One of the only times MM get public recognition is when someone has announced their graduation. If the groups is just releasing standard songs (as they are) while not changing in lineup, the group will grow stale quickly since there's no news surrounding them. If management wants MM to gain a bigger fanbase, they need to stay in the media's radar. Once they have the media's attention, then they can actively promote the group (something they still struggle with) so that new eyes can be aware of and interested in the group.

 

^Rather than a "big senior clean out" for Angerme, I think it's simply a case of the members being there for a long time. Dawa's hitting her 13th year as an idol including Egg days, and 2ki are around 6 years. Dawa did say she has no intention of graduating but i don't trust what these idols say lmao so i give her 2 more years tops before she's out the door, 3/4 more years for 2ki if we're lucky. All of them will eventually have to graduate so it's better to add in girls who can maintain the groups popularity once those members leave. 

[Ares13]

^ .. for MM ..
I think it's true that if they remain the same line up .. it may get stale ..
and I have said H!P seem to be very into selling freshness hype with new groups and new lineups ..
But I guess the tough thing will be to balance that ..
If they graduate too many too fast .. they will lose fans faster they can get from the media hype of the graduation ..

they also have the problem of the members not going off fast enough while they just keep adding new members ..
They are at 14 .. soon 13 .. which is getting awfully close to 16 which is the numbers of a 48G team ..
We all know the 48G teams tend to be too huge that the popularity and focus usually are very lopsided
and MM seem to be heading closer to that now ..

Then there is the next problem of quality ..
As in this time and age where idols are like everywhere ..
The fans they got from the hype may just be pretty causal supporting any and every group that just hype to them ..
while they are losing some really hardcore fans who will just go off with their idols when they graduate ..

So I do not agree of them doing that freshness hype thing but they seem to be doing that now ..

[ajma93632]

^
^
I agree that MM is about additions and grduations but as Ares said there has to be some balance between freshness and stability. Because I think it's necessary to give focus to most of the members, the time between Kanon's grad and 13ki was good enough to give some spotlight to members like Erina and Haruna, the 62nd single and the My Vision tour was a good way to promote them for the fans. Of course keeping the freshness by making many changes would draw them more attention from public but (as Ares said again ) that would mean just getting casual fans that could easily leave for another group that hypes them more. So I don't think we'd want that for MM. I prefer for MM and H!P to gain new fans little by little while those who are already fans become more loyal FOR THE GROUP(S); instead of trying so hard to get public's attention, that could end up with then being just an ephimeral trend.

So i think freshness and stability are both necessary for H!P groups, freshness to gain more attention and new fans, and stability to gain more loyalty from fans TO THE GROUP.

The next single will be the second moment of freshness for MM so for the next after that should be a moment of stability. I don't know what will be the next year for MM but since they have 3 new faces from this year, stability is more needed. Releasing 3 singles with the same line up wouldn't be bad for the group right? And then more members could be added if any of the older members graduated.

[meichan111]

Yeah wished they raised the instead than down like akb have up to 21 and that way we could receive very talented girls that have done it long time

[megumibex]

It's crazy when you think that Tsunku's oldest daughter is now just old enough to audition...Imagine that...